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Assuming Lawrence Tynes will beat out any and all competition that comes his way in camp, here's a question.
Would you try to find a kicker to handle strictly kickoffs? How much of a burden would that be on a team that really can't afford -- roster-wise, not financially -- many luxury items? Would you go so far as to spend a draft pick on a strong-legged kid, or would he have to be a veteran?
Floor's open.
EP
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Well EP, the Giants should and could have drafted a kicker last year instead of wasting their 6th and 7th round draft picks on players who had very little chance of making the team.
ReplyDeleteI don't know why they seem so opposed to drafting a kicker. Just look at the success of Nate Kaeding and David Buehler just to mention a couple.
As somebody else said yesterday....... please just a kicker who can kick it in the end zone!! What do the Giants have against kickers??? Why is Al Davis one of the only people in the NFL to understand the importance of the kicking game and paying accordingly???
ReplyDeleteI'm sure there is a NFL stat somewhere that tells you how many 'big' plays happen on special teams late in the season vs. early..
ReplyDeleteI would be willing to bet you get more big plays on kick off returns in the last few weeks then any other time (injuries n a long season taking it's toll).. Given that, spending a mid to late round draft pick on a strong-legged kid could be wise..
'Especially if he has the additional ability of being accurate with a few long distance field goals as a bonus!
I agree with the above comment. Having a kicker that can produce touchbacks is invaluable. It also atleast partially solves/addresses the Giants' problem of exceptionally poor kickoff coverage - the Giants were near the bottom if not last in the NFL in opponents starting field position. So yes, draft a young kid - not before the 5th round
ReplyDeletehowever - 6th or 7th round might be worth a shot.
I am going to have to agree with the others regarding the drafting of a kicker. I also think it might not be a bad idea to try to get someone with some return skills in the late rounds.
ReplyDeleteOn another note, why hasn't anyone been talking about a trade with San Diego? They want a running back and are looking to get rid of Cromartie.
We could use help in the secondary and have been talking about the increasing futility of carrying Brandon "tip-toe" Jacobs.
Any thoughts on the potential trade? Ernie?
I am pretty sure its a very weak kicking class. Reading about the kickers coming out isn't getting me excited. Why waste a draft pick when you can most likely pick up a kid after the draft?
ReplyDeletei would not waste a draft pick on a kicker
ReplyDeleteJust sign a kick off specialist for one year, then get in position to draft Alex Henery next year and replace Tynes, Feagles and Specialist with one guy...
ReplyDeleteWhy would we trade for Cromartie? The Giants secondary was exposed mainly because of the inability of the front 7 to get to the QB which would have been minimized with safeties that could actually cover someone.
ReplyDeleteThe Giants need to address the issue at hand and re-tool the front 7 and get a 'real' safety prospect (ala Earl Thomas) that could play the slot in a pinch if asked to do so. Now whether the Giants feel that their 1st round draft pick is worth using on a safety is a different story, but recent high draft picks spent on safeties have proven to be moore than benefical for those respective teams.
I don't think you can say the secondary was exposed MAINLY b/c of the front 7. The front 7 were not the ones letting receivers get behind them. Kiwi and Osi were both in the top 5 in the league in qb hits. I think the relationship goes both ways. If the secondary could cover people. Those hits could have turned into sacks.
ReplyDeleteErnie, for the life of me I can't see why the Giants use a specialist for kickoffs. The excuse that it ties up a roster spot is rubbish. How many times does your last Olineman, Dlineman, WR, DB, etc. actually help you each game - barring some sort of injury calaminty? A kickoff specialist will help you EVERY GAME with good (or bad on your point of view) field position. He could also be used late in a half or game for a long field goal attempt that might be out of our regular kickers range.
ReplyDeleteSorry, the above comment should read "Why the Giants would NOT use a apecialist for kickoffs."
ReplyDeleteWhy stop with only the kickoff problems? Why not address the lousy special teams play overall?
ReplyDeleteI guess the term 'mainly' is too subjective as the Giants had many other weaknesses that attributed to such a poor defense such as having Osi going out on coverage and the call for blitzes that have no chance reaching the opposing QB.
ReplyDeleteNonetheless, Terell Thomas has proven to be a good CB, Corey Webster (although he relapsed to his old ways) is still above average, and then there's Aaron Ross who has proven he can be good. Why make a trade for Cromartie who will be up for a contract extension?
The salary cap doesn't just manage itself.
I'm not a fan of trading for Cromartie either. I think our secondary will be much better this year if Phillips can come back and we can get a complimentary safety.
ReplyDeletePhillips was on his way for a break out year and his lost obviously limited what the defense could do, especially against good teams (excluding Dallas as we were able to match up against them for some strange reason).
ReplyDeleteSo, I really couldn't agree with you more that he coming back will greatly improve the secondary. Hopefully, the Giants can also improve the run defense. What can I say...this was just a bad defense to watch.
And yeah, the Giants need to improve the special teams play overall. Again, the Giants could have easily used that wasted 6th round pick.
Draft a Kicker or go after Graham from Cincy. Plain and simple
ReplyDeleteWe need a kicker who doesn't crack under pressure and someone who can boot it into the endzone. If you can't do either your not a kicker (sorry Tynes)
ReplyDeleteI just learned about this Guy from Nebraska somebody wrote about in this thread, Kearney. Intriguing, he will probably be a second round pick or higher next year or the year after. It has always been a dream to have one guy punt and kick.
ReplyDeleteAnyone remember Brad Daluiso? I don't see the reason why they can't carry that kind of specialist on the roster.
ReplyDeleteAnd to the commenter who put equal blame on both the DL and secondary for the team's defensive collapse--try covering a receiver for 5 seconds. Even the best CBs in the league can't do that. When a QB has that much time, as we saw many times last season, a receiver is bound to be open.
i think its pointless to sign a kicker just for kick-offs, especially as one of th mian reasons we signed Tynes in the first place was because of his supposed kick off ability.
ReplyDeleteTom, that was exactly my point.
ReplyDeleteThe secondary got a really raw deal. It's one thing to hold up against the likes of the Chiefs, but it's an entirely different thing against a team like the Eagles, the Chargers, and every other team that had their way when pove came to shove.
What a season like the one the Giants just had proves just how good Spagnuolo was as a defensive coordinator.
I'm not giving the DL a pass here. I am just saying you can't blame the weakness in the secondary mainly on the DL. They both deserve the blame. A good secondary can make a dline look better than they are and a good dline can make a secondary look better than they are. It goes both ways.
ReplyDeleteActually Spacey, the Giants went after Tynes out of desperation. After Jay Feely, the Giants had no clear cut options manning the position. For crying out loud, Tynes only had to beat out Josh Huston. Yuck!
ReplyDeleteI am lucky to be both a Big Blue fan and a Big Red fan (Nebraska). To comment on Alex Henrey, he is both the P and PK for the Huskers; however, he does not handle kick-offs. I do not know the full strength of his leg regarding kickoffs, because I have never seen him do it. I will tell you that the dude is an amazing place kicker, who's career long was a game winning 57 yarder against Colorado. He is also a dangerous punter and gets good angles on his boots. My only concern would be the kickoffs, but he should clear that up next year during combine and pro day. I would love to have him wearing blue some day!
ReplyDeleteWayno - "Why is Al Davis one of the only people in the NFL to understand the importance of the kicking game and paying accordingly???"
ReplyDeleteMaybe because he can't understand the value of any other position on the field?
How many times did teams start between the 30-40 yard lines last year. Find a kicker (either FA or draft) that can kick the ball deep into the end zone. We can't find one space on the active roster for a someone like that? Your keeping people active for special teams anyway that do not contribute anything.
ReplyDeleteMy God yes, find someone who can put kickoffs in the end zone, either through the draft or as a free agent. (No need to spend a draft pick unless another team will be taking them.) Spend another roster spot on a field goal kicker (Tynes or whoever) if need be. Particularly with the Giants' relatively weak kickoff coverage, it's essential.
ReplyDeleteRemember how valuable "Coffin Corner" Feagles was a couple of years ago in the field position game (and not so bad last year either)? And I don't know how many folks have read it, but Bill Parcells is on record that one of the reasons for the Super Bowl win over Buffalo was the field position advantage provided by Phil McConkey fielding punts, while Buffalo let 'em bounce and roll.
This will make as much difference to whether the Giants win or lose a given football game as most low-round draft picks (OK, Kevin Boss was an exception), so I say go ahead.
Kickers.....are we really talking about a kicker?
ReplyDeleteFirst, fire Quinn. He messed up Tynes and Feagles mechanics and he is an absolute bust as a special teams coach. Whatever pictures this guy has on Reese, Coughlin or the Mara's they must be good.
Do that then we can start to have a discussion on kickers....I guess.
Why does Quinn still have a job???
ReplyDeleteNYG HATE LIST
1. Tynes
2. Osi
3. Quinn
NYG LOVE LIST
1. Defensive playmaker who competes for the NFL defensive rookie of the year.
2. Giant Girl--- take that Fireman Ed the Ass
3. Tuck
Response to Dweez re : Al Davis
ReplyDeleteWhile this last contract to Janikowski seems a little extreme, Davis has always paid to have A good all around kicking game that is usually one of the best. The only guy the previous five years I liked more than Feagles was Lechler. Even Belichek let Viniteri go and I couldn't understand it as it only a small amount extra. There are others but Al Davis has always been aggressive in kicking.
I posted this on the Folk discussion but I'll add it here again. A lot of teams have one kicker for kickoffs and one for field goals. I know that loses a valuable spot for a "real" football player, but if you can consistently have your opposition starting at their 20 yard line, isn't that worth an extra special teams player? Also, if the kicker gets hurt you have a backup.
ReplyDeleteThe secondary is NOT getting a "raw deal". Everyone knows that it's impossible to cover a good wideout for 5 or more seconds. Our secondary didn't cover anyone at ALL at times because they didn't know where to be.
ReplyDeleteJud:
ReplyDeleteThe punt returner for the Giants against Buffalo was Meggett, not McConkey.
Wayn02424, in case you haven't noticed, Al Davis has a tendency to over pay just about any position. With all of the needs the Raiders have on the team, you'd think a little bit more thought would go into managing the salary cap. Nothing against the kicker...just very poor managament.
ReplyDeleteLet me add to this...not only did the secondary get a 'raw deal', but so did the entire defense.
ReplyDeleteI guess you're not big on facts and winning.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
ReplyDelete"I guess you're not big on facts and winning."
If you want to make a legitimate point, you need to either come up with a handle or a name. 16 of these posts are by "anonymous" which makes it all but impossible to know whether you're saying anything of value or not because there is no way to distinguish your "anonymous" post, or posts, from the others. If you've got something to say of value, and I'm not saying that you do not, please identify yourself in some way or another.
To Anonymous at 8:02 am - Thanks for the correction.
ReplyDeleteI believe Parcells' thoughts about whichever game it was (I seem to remember it was a playoff game and McConkey) were in a Michael Lewis article in the NY Times Magazine.