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You go off for Easter Sunday with the family and look what happens. The Eagles (and by extension the city of Philadelphia) sends their starting quarterback to the Redskins for a second this year and a conditional fourth-round pick that could turn into a third-rounder next season.
So now we're left to sift around the rubble to figure out trading Donovan McNabb to the Redskins helps or hurts the Giants.
Overall, and this is assuming that the now-rickety McNabb can stay healthy, I believe it hurts them. Despite the presence of DeSean Jackson on the Eagles' roster, the Redskins have a more accomplished receiving corps. And now they've got a real quarterback to get them the ball. Jason Campbell may have made progress last season, but even at his best he's nowhere near as dynamic when as the new guy when McNabb gets hot.
If you think guys like Santana Moss, tight end Chris Cooley, and up-and-comer Devin Thomas weren't celebrating the news, think again. They'll probably pick up a wide receiver in the draft, too.
Meanwhile, the Eagles will turn the page to begin the Kevin Kolb era in earnest. But Kolb has proven himself at least an able passer -- if he hadn't the Eagles wouldn't have made that move. And Michael Vick is still there for the role of running quarterback. So, again assuming McNabb can stay healthy, the Redskins are automatically better and the Eagles should remain about the same.
One more thing. The Redskins' running game is in tatters. However, McNabb is a heck of a lot more mobile than Campbell. He's not going to total a bunch of yards with his legs anymore, but he's still elusive enough to buy time for guys like Moss to get open downfield.
It was a bold move that immediately improved Washington on paper. All told, the road just got tougher, not easier, for the Giants.
EP
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Gotta disagree with you on this one, Ernie. Unless the Skins significantly improve their O line, I think McNabb is "dead man walking". He's always been prone to getting a little banged up, but Philly was always been committed to having bodies in front of him. Without a decent O line, I think he's on IR by week 8. Also, I figure Cooley's numbers will go way down because the Skins will forced to keep a TE in to block. Finally, does two games really "prove" that Kolb is an able passer? In my mind, that book is still open. He may be good, he may be awful. I don't think we'll know for sure until he's played at least one full season. Once the League's defensive coordinators start to get a lot of film on him, someone will figure out his weakness and exploit it. Then, all the the other teams will follow suit. The great ones know their weaknesses and work around it. We don't know if Kolb can do that yet.
ReplyDeleteThis definately HELPS the Giants. The skins recieving core is no where near as good as the Eagles. Desean Jackson and Jermy Macklin have a hell whole lot more upside than Thomas and are better recievers right now than Santana Moss. The skins have a bunch of washed up rb's and OL and McNabb will play 12 games max. On paper the Eagles were better than the Giants but no more.
ReplyDeleteI have to say I am on the fence with Kolb too, but the games I did see him in he was actually pretty good. The guy has definitely got potential. Whether he proves to be the Eagles answer to a Super Bowl, well only time will tell. Also it's one thing to play as a backup and another when you become the full time starter. Let's see how it works out.
ReplyDeleteAs for McNabb in Washington...I don't know. Overall Washington seems like a weak team with no O-line, barely a running game, and their defense while good is not crushingly dominant. They need pieces to back McNabb and I am not sure they have them or if they will be able to fill them with the draft.
I like McNabb, good quarterback, seemingly good guy, in a very tough town with tough circumstances, i.e. Owens. I think Philly will miss the him.
McNabb is not a good guy or any of that garbage u want to pedal, remember the phone? That was a 30 year old man who was shown class by the Giants for years and gave none of it back because he is stupid and a TERRIBLE leader. There were many other instances where he showed no class but was always made to be a good guy because he put up with TO.
ReplyDeleteAnd one more thing about him, this early HOF campaign the media has undertaken is LAUGHABLE. He has to do A LOT MORE. And I mean A LOT!
I have to disagree as well Ern, and agree with the comments. The Skins offense has nowhere near the talent of a Jackson or a Maclin and even a Celek. And as others brought up, the Skins have no O-line and you even eluded to their lack of a running game.
ReplyDeletePortis, LJ and "Slick" Willie Parker may have been a dream team five years ago, but not 2010. I'm sure they'll try and fix the O-line, but that will take time and the RBs are over the hill.
I'm also not sold on Kolb. The guy started against a terrible KC defense and threw the ball all over the field and then came in during garbage time and threw for 300 yards. So, he played in two games -- one was meaningless and the other was against a terrible team.
Sure this guy could be good, but I'm not sold. The Eagles are now much more of an unknown and the Skins are better, but that much? Are they a 9-7 team this year?
I think the move hurts the Eagles this year and improves the Skins. So, now the Eagles who were probably ahead of the Giants are now about equal. And the Skins who were below the Giants I think are still below, but are probably closer to mediocrity, 8-8 maybe.
I am holding on my opinion until after the draft. I agree that the Skins do not have the weapons for McNabb that Philly does. But, I believe the Skins will try to surround McNabb with some weapons before the start of the season. I foresee them drafting an OT in the first round and maybe a WR or RB in rounds 3 and/or 4. Shannahan is a smart guy and he will find a way to put a competitive team out there. In regards to the Eagles, yes Kolb showed flashes of being a quality NFL QB, but I also agree that d-coordinators will find a weakness and exploit it. Overall, I think this move helps the Giants, because McNabb will have to get used to a new coach for the first time in his career and Kolb is a huge question mark.
ReplyDeleteLiving in washington I can give you their perspective:
ReplyDelete-instant upgrade at QB. They can actually trade Jason Campbell and get back the 3rd or 4th round pick they added into this deal.
-Their O-line was much better after they picked up Levi Jones at the end of last season. They also added Artis Hicks from Minnesota via FA and Mike Williams, who made a great comeback from obesity to play last season. Taking a O-lineman with the 4th pick gives them a nice start towards rebuilding this unit.
-As per the running game, remember they signed Larry Johnson and Willie Parker this offseason as well to give them competition with Portis. I think the Johnson signing was a good one, with the zone blocking scheme of Shanahan, he could rejuvenate his career.
-defensively, they added Phillip Buchanon.
-they also added Jim Haslet as the D coordinator.
-i agree that they do not have a strong WR core, but certainly not too bad. Keep in mind that they have two good TEs in Cooley and Fred Davis.
This is a team that has used a better managed approach to their offseason than in previous years. I'm not sure that the Giants have brought as much impact via FA this year.
It always seems that the Redskins win the offseason superbowl.
ou should stay in DC with all the delusional fans like urself. "they added Phillip Buchanon" hahaah hahah "They can actually trade Jason Campbell and get back the 3rd or 4th round pick they added into this deal" hahah ahahah ahahhah
ReplyDelete"Their O-line was much better after they picked up Levi Jones at the end of last season" ahhah ahhah and I dont see Jim Haslett putting on any uni's or some sort of savior hahah ahhaah ahhah Haslett the GENIUS hahah ahha ahhah SKINS SUCK and u liked the Johnson signing hahah ahah ahah
It's Andy Reid and Marty Mornhinweg that make the QBs in Philly, Reid has made guys like AJ Feeley, Coy Detmer and Jeff Garcia look good, they made an inaccurate passer like McNabb look great, they're going make Kolb into a superstar.
ReplyDeleteWayno...I don't get your comments. This is the perspective of DC sports on this trade on other aspects of their offseason. What part of it do you find problem with? They WILL be able to trade Jason Campbell, a guy who has started for 4 years in the NFL...are you kidding me? He's a better backup than Sorgi. They will get 4th rd for him at least. They did add Buchanon, to go with DeAngelo Hall.
ReplyDeleteNobody said Haslett was a genius, he is a coach with a good defensive resume. The Giants had a coach last season without a resume to speak of last season and look where it got them.
They were able to piece together an offensive line with FA and players cut loose from other teams. You know that they'll do well with the zone blocking system of Shanahan. By doing this trade, they can focus on getting a top flight LT in 1st round of the draft.
Their backfield would appear to be the equal, if not better, than the Giants.
Perhaps the only area where they are weak is WR, but this will also be improved by the presence of McNabb.
Wayno, I think you're just bitter because Jerry Reese hasn't done anything to improve or address the Giant's weaknesses. A backup QB and an overpriced safety are all you can show for the offseason...what do these guys do to earn their money. ...oh I forgot, a washed up punter too...
Dude, all I can tell you is that you listed everything except the only thing the Redskins actually have going for them: Shanahan.
ReplyDeleteBecause of him, you'll be competitive in 2 years and in the playoffs again within 4 years. By that time, the Giants will still be good and the Eagles and Cowboys will have run their course and hit the skids.
To the anonymous Skins fan - you made some decent points. I have always been surprised that a Washington defense that looks outstanding on paper hasn't been more dominant on the field. God knows, I wish Fletcher was a Giant LB! I think getting a new HC was huge for you guys. I suspect you will be more competitive, but there are still too many holes for this one trade to fill them all. As for your comment about Campbell getting you guys a third or fourth, no chance. BEFORE this trade, sure. I actually would LOVE to see Jason Campbell as a backup here in NY. Much like Carr did, I think you would see Campbell thrive if he was in the Giants system. That said, DC has absolutely NO leverage anymore. Everyone knows Campbell is gone. With only a year left on his contract, he's not even attractive as a long term solution and/or backup. The Skins will be extremely fortunate to get a low fifth round pick for him now. All the other teams know Washington has to move him, so they will low-ball the Skins and, eventually, the Skins will have to give in to keep Campbell from becoming a distraction. As for Wayno, just don't get him started on PSLs and it will be fine. He's like that crazy cousin that every family has. As long as you don't have to go out with him in public, he can be pretty entertaining.
ReplyDeleteActually, to the Skins fan, who probably didn't watch many Giants games, safety was a major weakness of the team, and they just signed two quality ones. Also, let's be fair, sure Rolle is overpaid, but this is coming from a Skins fan who's team signed Fat Albert a year ago. How's that working out?
ReplyDeleteIs Albie going to the off season programs yet? Does he plan on showing up for training camp? I heard the Skins actually tried to deal him to Philly in the McNabb deal. And let's be honest, that defense has gotten old -- Fletcher, Buchanan, Hall. And speaking about overrated -- how about that Laron Landry.
Listen, the Skins definitely improved by getting McNabb, but don't tell me they have the receiving talent, line play or RBs that the Eagles do.
As far as the RBs compare to the Giants, LJ and Willie Parker haven't had a good season since 2007. So, now all of a sudden, they're going to come to Washington and flip a switch, three years after they were legit running threats? I'm sorry, not buying it.
Washington got better, just not that much better.
Lots of hostility for some reason or another.
ReplyDeleteThis appears to be a good trade for both teams while assuring no cakewalks in the NFC East.
Many seem to disregard the effectiveness of Mike Shanahan's system. His zone blocking system produced a thousand yard rusher one after another. It almost didn't matter who was back there. What does matter is the personnel needed on the O-Line to run such a system which doesn't seem to be apparent on the current roster. Then again, maybe it is.
Nonetheless, the NFC East just became that much more competitive which, I for one, do not think is a bad thing.
NFC East will be more interesting whether it be parity, mediocrity or just watching the ups and downs for each team as well as the prognostications of the media writers as the weekly schedule evolves. Last year was a high, then an abysmal decline for NYG. The Boys started slow and then caught fire and the Birds were mostly moving up then crashed in the playoffs. The Skins will now have some ups and downs as go most teams with their (McNabb) scrambling and roll out QBs. Overall I like it - no excuses Now!
ReplyDeleteLou,
ReplyDeleteI think the eagles might be good for awhile. They've pretty much redid the entire offense in 2 years, if they show anything at all this year, watch out because they are very young and very talented.
Did Shanahan's zone blocking system work in Denver? Yeah, sometimes, when he had the personnel to do it. You need quick, young guys who are ready to get dirty (face it, his "genius" is that he has his O linemen go for the D linemen's knees). I am not aware of five guys on the current Washington roster that fit that description. Plus, as NY found out the hard way this past season, it's really difficult to maintain the run game when the other team is lighting up your secondary. The NFC East of today resembles "Air Coryell" more than the old NFC "Beast" days of running at your opponents endlessly until they give. Is Shanahan a good coach and an improvement over Zorn? Absolutely! But let's keep some perspective here. Denver and Shanahan haven't won the Super Bowl in well over a decade and it took Elway and Terrel Davis at his peak to win it back then. McNabb ain't Elway and none of the Skins RBs are Super Bowl era Terrel Davis quality. The Skins are better than they were. They are, however, still a fundamentally flawed team. Shanahan cannot undo years of damage caused by Snyder and Cerrato in one trade and/or with his borderline illegal blocking scheme.
ReplyDeleteMy initial reaction was the McNabb's trade to the Redskins was bad for the Giants, as compared to McNabb moving out of the division. He always seems to have his best games against the Giants. So now the 2 Redskin games each year are more of a challenge. For the Giants, the Eagles may slide back a little. But over all, I'd say this is a negative for the Giants, not a positive. The division just got that much tougher.
ReplyDeleteI'm with Ernie on this one guys. I fail to see how this is a positive for the Giants. Last year, we crushed the Redskins both times we played them. We did that with a bottom 10 QB in Campbell playing against us. Heck, he made our D look good! Now they will have McNabb, a top 10 QB.
ReplyDeleteAs well, the Eagles don't make this move if they don't think Kolb can play. It's like the Green Bay situation. Say what you will about the Iggles but they aren't run by a bunch of dummies.
The Skins will draft at number 4 to LT. They will get a stud. Alternatively they can pick up Flozell for a year. Either way, they have options on the O line. They don't have great receivers but McNabb has worked all his career with a sub par group and got good results.
No, this isn't a positive for the Giants. The entire conference got better as a result of this trade. That being said, I still think we can win the division but the road will be tougher.
Chris B.
Another question relating to the Eagles shopping McNabb for a low round 2 selection. Rumblings out there that they will use their #1 and this Washington #2 (37) and bundle them for a move up to one of the top 5 or 10 slots. Who do they covert to make such a move....another OL, or DL, maybe even a LB? Any insights from those in the know?
ReplyDeleteBit of a mixed bag; i agree with guys who say that the Eagles receivers are better and that McNabb will have a tougher time of it in DC. However, he does immediately improve the Skins. he might not be the guy to get them to a superbowl, but he is the guy who will keep them competative for the next few year whilst Shanahan looks for and develops a B of the future; look for John Skelton to be drafted in the later rounds maybe.
ReplyDeleteAs for the o-line, yeah, its rubbish, but with the 4th overall pick you can bet your heini that they're taking Okung if hes there or another tackle (they may even trade down and pick up a few more picks).
as for the Eagles, it makes sense here as well. they have some gaps on the roster and an extra 2nd rounder helps. the Kolb situation is risky, but when is moving onto a new QB ever not? sometimes, you just have to take a risk. he showed enough, i think to be given a chance to start. give him a whole off-season load of reps as the starter and not the back up, he'll do a good job.
Eagles with 5 picks in the first 90 slots of the draft, or something silly like that. Their front office knows how to get it done and when to let go of players in decline.
ReplyDelete"Their front office knows how to get it done and when to let go of players in decline."
ReplyDeleteIt's okay to like this trade and think it's a smart move. But to talk like the Philly FO is filled with geniuses when they have managed ZERO Super Bowl wins in 44 years is a bit much. Maybe, if they held on to one or more of those "players in decline" for a year or two more, they would have a Lombardi in the trophy case. Let's remember they chose Freddie Mitchell in the first round. Somtimes stockpiling picks works against you.
Geniuses, maybe not, but no one can argue with the Eagles success in recent years. I mean, really. When was the Eagles last losing season?
ReplyDeleteTheir front office is good. The draft is how they seem to build the trenches. For whatever reason, however, they just seem to miss on the skilled positions. Then again, we've been guilty of that ourselves with the likes of Sinorice Moss. Nonetheless, the Eagles have right the ship as a result of the last 2 drafts.
I have a feeling that the Redskins will get on board and probably try to trade down, get a few extra picks, and grab a falling player like Dez Bryant. All of a sudden, the Skins aren't too bad.
I don't know what Eagles games you were watching but Dallas made their O line look like swiss cheese and the D is pretty mediocre at best. Giants have three rings, Philly has zero. When you remember that the Giants lost an entire decade due to a family fight by the Maras, those three rings look even better. I'll take NY's front office until Philly wins one. Otherwise, what it looks like to me is the Eagles FO trades a guy as soon as his salary gets a bit too large for Lurie's taste.
ReplyDelete